posted 12-12-2001 02:37 PM               

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First off, this is not a Street Fighter game.

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It's a Versus Game, and the Marvel Characters pretty much dominate it.

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If you don't like it, tough shit, little man, that's just the way it is.

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Stop crying about it and go home and do whatever it is you do in your spare time away from the computer.

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Secondly, you bitch about the many broken things about MvC2.

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Every game's been broken in some way that I can think of.

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Oh, what's that, my crouching strong button is wearing out from too much use? Oh, wait, I can only use three or four characters to win? Yay, I got two hypers before you did! Look at the screen! Everyone remembers the Marvel machine nicknamed Infinite: The Game. Oh, go ahead and attack me...I've got V-ism, sucker!

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Whine whine whine. You're pretty bitter, sounds to me like you've got your ass handed to you on a silver platter by anyone who took the time to try and figure out the game.

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And games are just for fun?

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Game: An activity providing entertainment or amusement

If you don't think the game's fun, why would you play it? God, your level of idiocy is off the charts.

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Infinites are cheap? What infinites are you talking about, exactly, that are full life?

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I'd much rather be hit with a Magneto infinite than a Shockwave combo..it does pathetic damage. Oh, what's that, Hyper-grav Magnetic tempest does so much damage, whine whine?

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~cough~ Mash ~cough~

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Cable's cheap? Oh my god, anyone with an air dash can beat me...AAAGH!

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And you whine about calling assists over and over and over. Well, any SF game you play is about repetition, and the VS series are no exception.

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So if you don't like the game, don't play it, don't whine and cry and tear like a baby.

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Go away and stop bothering people who actually take the time to learn games, instead of imagining that what they know is what's good and what everyone else does is cheap.

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Moron.

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posted 12-12-2001 02:43 PM               

- Alan

posted 12-13-2001 06:33 AM               

GGX is really tight, I like it a lot. I think most of the complaints people have focused on other games don't seem to apply to this one as much. Of course, looking at it, I'm blown away by the beauty and sound, so I could be biased. Also I've yet to give it enough serious time to discover the mechanical workings of it, and to find loopholes. Not to mention the level of competition here isn't high enough to really poke holes in the game yet.

I almost like it better that way.

....Naw, I love high competition, the harder, the better.

But seriously, I think anyone could logically complain about anything in any game. A lot of people offer their opinions on games, thinking no one should disagree with them, and many of these opinions are simply based on personal preferences that have no serious scope on the game's enjoyment level. The true marker for enjoyment, at least by most gaming companies, is how much money it makes, and MvC2 is, by these standards, a dazzling success.

Pity A3 didn't achieve such glorious heights, I loved that game. Still do.

posted 12-13-2001 06:45 AM               

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Also, you guys shouldn't forget that this game is dying out anyway.

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T4 is a pretty decent new game, although most of the Tekkenite fans from TTT days don't seem to like it as much as they did older versions, it's still offering pretty stiff competition.

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CvS2 of course seems extremely popular, and a lot of folks in my area of getting into GGX.

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GGX is really tight, I like it a lot.

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I think most of the complaints people have focused on other games don't seem to apply to this one as much.

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posted 12-13-2001 07:05 AM               

Guilty Gear X
Boss: Dizzy: Posibly the most annoying ***** to ever grace fighting games! This girl looks innocent but she'll beat you down as bad as Justice could! A fright to all Guilt Gear beginners!

MvC2
My personal thoughs:

Assists are a part of this game, like it or not. But the fact of abusing them is in my mind regarded as ridiculous. If you are a "pro", as they are called, you should be able to win by fighting rather than the old tactic of "keep away and assist". I myself dislike attempting to chase someone who won't fight back unless i'm very low on life.

Infinites make the game dull. But the fact that their hard(some) to pull off makes it sorta relievable. But regardless if you need infinites to win, in my mind, that makes you obviously not a "pro".

Characters in this game are either good, in the middle or decent, or just suck. Take Magneto and Ironman. These 2 are by far the most ridiculous characters. Nobody rivals their abilities. Ironman with his quicknes(how is it possible with that armor!?) can easily beat a player. Magneto is faster but his combo's are so damaging 6 hits or less takes you past 1/2 your life bar. Plus his link up combo's into HC's, are absurd. (Mash is the only counter to the Hyper Grav combo) But sometimes he's a little too quick to get away from. They shoulda toned down these characters.

Decent or mid characters. Akuma, Ryu, Ken, and Dan are good examples. Though i hear Akuma takes hard damage, he can deal it out just as bad, if not worse. Ken has quickness on his side and decent power, he is an excellent choice for people who like fire!
Ryu is the same o same o. He's balanced, can get out good damage, and combo's good. Nothing wrong with em. Dan is...well.... Dan. His fireballs make suck and all but he can beat you down if he gets close enough.

Sorry characters. Though some disagree(heavily) Felicia is one that goes here. Here attacks have absolutely no range(except for 1) Her Launcher has like a range of 0.5(at least Chun-Li's moves!) She obviously isnt that great. Plus she does crap for damage.
Anakaris is also in this category. What weed was Capcom smoking when they decided this!? Anakaris is just about the sorriest character in a game next to T.Hawk! He's usless, takes ridiculous damage, and his HC's are pretty lame and rarely hit. This guys no good.

posted 12-13-2001 07:18 AM               

Starcraft

Though i never really played the very first game without any patches of the times, i still know how bad Zerg ruled the game. Protoss and Terran had little chance against the Zerg. Sum up: Zerg were god.

Brood wars came along and it all changed. Terran became god-like because of their medics, Zerg became far god-der like when they acquired the Lurker, and Protoss where given the Corsair and Dark Templar(gods themselves).

While lots of players talk about how there is a counter for everything, this is not neccesarily true. The Dark Templar are excellent examples. They will dominate Terran with ease, though people say "counter with detection" and all this other bs, the fact remains that DT's are SO quick they can run before they are seen by the scan and then they can come right back! Others will say missile turets or Sci Vessels. Ok, 1: You will NOT have Sci Vessels by the time DT's come, 2: All someone has to do is send in a distraction while your units attack the distraction, the DT's come along and destroy the turrets, or use the distraction along with the DT's for quicker turret razing. It's ridiculous the power of these guys have.

Zerg have the god-like Lurker now. this unit(before 1.08, nowtheir controllabe somewhat)was too easy to make, cheap and fast. When they were sent to kill Protoss or Terran, they were almost certain to succeed. They kill infantry like nothing and neeeding detection only made it worse.

Terran...well they arent so great still. They WOULD be pretty usless if not for Tanks, BC's, Goliaths, and Medics. Without these 4 they have almost no chance. The BC's can soak up damage with upgrades(Zerg can barely beat this if at all), Goliats are the gods of ATA attack, Medics are ridiculous healers that are hard to kill, and Tanks are the distance GTG killers. Tanks are the main suport of Terran, without it they suck at GTG attack(excluding MM&F sometimes).

Well again thats my thoughts! I'll be back for more later!

posted 12-14-2001 04:48 AM               

...wow. You really nailed that one. I mean...from every angle. Good examples, too.

Ironically, you've acted as my "assist character" in this thread.

posted 12-14-2001 07:11 AM               

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Nice name.

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Anyways, you fully illustrate the point that Sirlin was making.

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You complain about things like infinites and helper abuse and say that they're "cheesy tactics" and that there's no way around it.

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Maybe with your friends when you play MvC2 you don't use assists "too much" (whatever THAT means)

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and don't do long combos (again whatever THAT is supposed to mean).

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Yet other people used assists as much as they could from day 1, did every infinite or long combo they could think of as soon as they learned it, yet lo and behold the game still turned out good.

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. MvC2 is probably the biggest arcade hit since hyper fighting, which says a lot considering that the arcade business is falling flat on it's ass right now.

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Cable repeat AHVBs is NOT an infinite.

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Long combos that may take 100% are certainly worth noting but they are not infinites. Thx.

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Definition of an infinite: A combo you can continue forever under any circumstances.

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There are plenty of combos that do 100% in EVERY GAME.

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You single out Commando. Look at B5 and see how many people in the top 5 picked Commando. Only one of them did. (Valle) There's a reason for this. Commando is a crappy character (unless you're Alex).

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One of the things that gives MvC2 extra depth is that the characters with the good assists are in general, bad characters.

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Case in point, my match against Mike D (fight for 3rd place) at B5.

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Cammy is not a very good character when it comes time to fight.

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Because we play the FULL game and not the "do only what I say is OK" version of the game, when people were playing their hardest trying to win, I still knew what to do. You wouldn't.

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You think that people use assists too much? THAT'S YOUR FAULT!!! You're the one who's STUPID enough to let them keep using assists.

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They aren't "taking it easy on me" or whatever...they're trying to survive because they know I'll kill their character if they call assist one more time.

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He should thank you.

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Ironically, you've acted as my "assist character" in this thread.

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posted 12-14-2001 07:23 AM               

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Anyways, you fully illustrate the point that Sirlin was making. You complain about things like infinites and helper abuse and say that they're "cheesy tactics" and that there's no way around it.

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Actually all i've seen thus far are opinions!(and some arguments too) But hey everyone has valid points in their arguments. But then again some arent that valid.

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Maybe with your friends when you play MvC2 you don't use assists "too much" (whatever THAT means) and don't do long combos (again whatever THAT is supposed to mean).

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I think he means they dont use assists every 2-4 seconds like on those B5(what kinda name is this anyway?)tournament stuff. And i think he means long combo's as in the infinites and combos that go on for maybe 50 hits just because it was programmed that way<? Though this is just my interpretation of it. Oh well.

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People still play the game and like the game. MvC2 is probably the biggest arcade hit since hyper fighting, which says a lot considering that the arcade business is falling flat on it's ass right now.

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True about the arcade business unfortunately. But i think people only play this game still is because its the last of its kind and its the latest. So its going to stay popular until the next one(if it ever happens) comes out.

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1) Cable repeat AHVBs is NOT an infinite. Even if you could do them over and over (like you can on BH, Sent, Jugg etc), that is not an infinite. The reason that MvC2 is a better game than either of the other marvel games is because infinites are not really a factor. There are like...4 characters whose infinites come into play (Blackheart, Magneto, Iron Man, War Machine) in serious play...not to say that other characters don't, but for those 4 they can reasonably try for it without going out of their way. Anyways, those infinites don't even kill you. MvC2 has undizzy system built in. Too many repeat hits (this does not count super) / too short a time frame and you undizzy. Infinites are not a factor in high level MvC2.

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1. In actuality Cable's AHVB is in fact an infinite. "Of or relating to a set capable of being put into one-to-one correspondence with a proper subset of itself". Thats the best f all of em and i'd say it verify's that Cable's AHVB is in fact an infinite. But everyone is free to choose how they want to consider it.

Least there isn't dizzy in this game. It'd make it even worse.

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Long combos that may take 100% are certainly worth noting but they are not infinites.

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Actually i think Long Combo's arent exactly worth noting since anyone can brag about,"I got a 999 hit combo with Ironman/Magneto!" But most will know the usual response>"Only in training mode." So i think long combo's arent really special.

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Thx.

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Also i just felt like it but, Thx? thx for what???

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There are plenty of combos that do 100%

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Too many in fact!

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There are plenty of combos that do 100% in EVERY GAME.

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Not in Xenogears!

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Commando is a crappy character (unless you're Alex)

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So Captain Commando is crappy unless he's used by this guy??? That doesnt seem right...

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One of the things that gives MvC2 extra depth is that the characters with the good assists are in general, bad characters

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This is definately not true. Some characters this can apply to(Anakaris) but there are lots of characters that have good assists AND are good characters! Akuma for example, while he isn't the best character ever, his assists can work wonders. People tend to "down" Akuma cause he takes high damage(less than Anakaris i might add ) but he can still give it back double or somewhat less of what you can as well(depednds on character).

posted 12-14-2001 10:19 AM            

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MvC2 is probably the biggest arcade hit since hyper fighting, which says a lot considering that the arcade business is falling flat on it's ass right now.

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NO, YOU'RE PLAYING THE ASSIST, ASSIST, ASSIST, ASSIST, ASSIST, ASSIST, ASSIST, ASSIST, ASSIST, ASSIST, ASSIST, ASSIST, ASSIST, ASSIST, ASSIST, ASSIST, ASSIST, ASSIST, ASSIST, ASSIST, ASSIST, ASSIST, ASSIST, ASSIST, ASSIST, ASSIST, ASSIST, ASSIST, ASSIST, ASSIST, ASSIST, ASSIST, ASSIST, ASSIST, ASSIST, ASSIST, ASSIST, ASSIST, ASSIST, ASSIST, ASSIST, ASSIST, ASSIST, ASSIST, ASSIST, ASSIST, ASSIST, ASSIST, ASSIST, ASSIST, ASSIST, ASSIST, ASSIST, ASSIST, ASSIST, ASSIST, ASSIST, ASSIST, ASSIST, ASSIST, ASSIST, ASSIST, ASSIST, ASSIST, ASSIST, ASSIST, ASSIST, ASSIST, ASSIST, ASSIST, ASSIST, ASSIST, ASSIST, ASSIST, ASSIST, ASSIST, ASSIST, ASSIST, ASSIST, ASSIST, ASSIST, ASSIST, ASSIST, ASSIST, ASSIST, ASSIST, ASSIST, ASSIST, ASSIST, ASSIST, ASSIST, ASSIST, ASSIST, ASSIST, ASSIST, ASSIST, ASSIST, ASSIST, ASSIST, ASSIST, ASSIST, ASSIST, ASSIST, ASSIST, ASSIST, ASSIST, ASSIST, ASSIST, ASSIST, ASSIST, ASSIST, ASSIST, ASSIST, ASSIST, ASSIST, ASSIST, ASSIST, ASSIST, ASSIST, ASSIST, ASSIST, ASSIST, ASSIST, ASSIST, ASSIST, ASSIST, ASSIST, ASSIST, ASSIST, ASSIST, ASSIST, ASSIST, ASSIST, ASSIST, ASSIST, ASSIST, ASSIST, ASSIST, ASSIST, ASSIST, ASSIST, ASSIST, ASSIST, ASSIST, ASSIST, ASSIST, ASSIST, ASSIST, ASSIST, ASSIST, ASSIST, ASSIST, ASSIST, ASSIST, ASSIST, ASSIST, ASSIST, ASSIST, ASSIST, ASSIST, ASSIST, ASSIST, ASSIST, ASSIST, ASSIST, ASSIST, ASSIST, ASSIST, ASSIST, ASSIST, ASSIST, ASSIST, ASSIST, ASSIST, ASSIST, ASSIST, ASSIST, ASSIST, ASSIST, ASSIST, ASSIST, ASSIST, ASSIST, ASSIST, ASSIST, ASSIST, ASSIST, ASSIST, ASSIST, ASSIST, ASSIST, ASSIST, ASSIST, ASSIST, ASSIST, ASSIST, ASSIST, ASSIST, ASSIST, ASSIST, ASSIST, ASSIST, version of the game. And I'd beat you any day, fag. I was the best at Marvel vs Capcom, that actually took skill, and me and my friend would get up to 50 matches played in a couple of hours playing. We were the best at that game. We're still the best at the game, and we'd beat any fags at Marvel vs Capcom 2 who tried to stop us.

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OH, I should take the controller away from them next game. Thanks, fag.

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Viscant you seem alittle high on yourself, you weren't at the tournament, and you probably suck at MVC2. Don't quote this and tell me that I was wrong, cause I know I am right and so does everyone else!

Dynamo and Viscant, are you two stupid? You are so dull, I enjoyed reading You're full of crap's post alot more!

posted 12-14-2001 10:55 AM               

"Long combos that take 100% life aren't worth doing?? WHY?! And they're not infinites? Wtf?? Why aren't they? If they take 100% life, they're infinites"

There IS a proper definition of what an infinite is and what it isn't. AGSF2 (I can't believe I just referenced that place) during the years and years that it was trying to make an FAQ had the proper definition of an infinite in all the early stages of the FAQ because everybody could agree on what it was. You can't use meter for it to be considered an infinite. Case in point. You put Cable out first. When the announcer says fight, then infinite me. What's that? You can't do it. You don't have the meter to do it. Therefore, it's not an infinite.
This is all pretty common sense stuff...

"Marvel vs Capcom was JUST as big an arcade hit as Marvel vs Capcom 2"

No it wasn't. MvC died out when Alpha 3 came out. Why was this? A3 was a better game. MvC had maybe 4-6 months when it was the main event game. MvC2 has been the main event game for almost 2 solid years now. It killed CvS1 pretty easily and is outdrawing CvS2 and Tekken 4 put together at SHGL right now. I loved MvC...it made me fall in love with competitive fighting games again after a long hiatus from video games. But it wasn't a very popular game at any stage in it's life for the simple reason that it wasn't a very good game.

"Name 1 combo that does 100% in Project Justice. .....You can't, so shut your newbie mouth."

I haven't seen the final version of PJ in all the times I've been to arcades, but I know that in the beta version that was at SHGL (in addition to having the rooftop glitch) almost every character had an infinite that was just doing ground chain over and over, crouch cancelling the last hit.

"No, captain commando doesn't suck, you just suck at playing the game with captain commando, so you blame the suckiness on him.
Oh gee, so "alex" can make a crappy character a good character with his magic wand or something? SHUT UP, NEWBIE"

Commando is a reflex driven character. If you don't have great reflexes, you won't win with him. Even if you ARE Alex though...Commando is still not worth much. If I have a team like say...Doom/Storm/Sentinel (one of my business teams), and you have someone/someone/commando, all I do is I mentally think to myself. "OK...if I don't try to kill Commando, all I have to do is make sure I have either 40% life left with Storm or Doom or 25% life left with Sentinel when Commando comes in and I'm still winning". It's true...a full life Commando is not worth 1/2 of what a real top tier character is worth. He has a great assist and people will use him for the assist. But if he gets snapped in, or has to fight at the end...he'll get dusted.

"IRON MAN SUCKS? IF YOU SAY HE SUCKS, THEN IT'S JUST YOU THAT SUCKS. THERE'S PLENTY OF GOOD CHARACTERS ON MARVEL VS CAPCOM 2 THAT HAVE GOOD ASSISTS. RETARD"

Iron Man does not have a very good assist and he's not a very good character either. Iron Man loses for free to Commando, Sentinel, Doom, Storm, Cyclops, Spiral, Iceman, Strider, etc, etc. I can go on if you'd like, but my point is made. He has 2 very average assists that don't do very much, but his assists don't really dominate.
Most of the good assists are on the Capcom side. This was smart game balancing by Capcom. They had to notice that in almost all of the Marvel games they'd made so far, the Street Fighter characters usually sucked. Why is that? They simply were not made to fight the Marvel characters. For example...Ryu's entire body is about the size of Juggernaut's arm when he does a jab. When you go to play a poking game, who do you think is going to win? So to compensate for that and to make sure that the Capcom side would be played they gave most of them really good assists. It worked. Cammy, Ken, Commando, etc. all regularly show up on tournament teams even though when they're active point characters they really can't pull their weight. It also provides a strategic question to the player. Do you believe assists are important? Do you choose 2 really strong point characters and 1 dominant assist? Or do you choose 3 point characters? Maybe 1 point and 2 assists? Or maybe you play a team like Commando/Cammy/Ken and you bet that the person you're playing is a scrub who doesn't know how to stop assists (hey...like you!!!) and you just run away and call helpers all day.
FYI, nobody ever does this in tournament play. The simple fact being that running away and calling assists doesn't work. No matter how many names you can think up to call me...it just doesn't work. You think it does? Prove it. Show me some proof. You don't have any, so don't waste your time.

"You didn't get no 3rd place, quit lying. I guess that means I could've got 2nd place, cause I can definitely beat YOU at the game, newb."

You can check brackets on shoryuken.com if you wish. I'm listed as Viscant (too bad I lost the right to my real name). If you think you could do better than me then you should start going to tournaments. Lots of free money to be had for you if you're that good.

"I'd beat YOU with cammy. God, what am I talkin about, I'd beat YOU with SERVEBOT."

The best Cammy player in the world (Justin Wong) knows better than to play Cammy on me. In our tournament matches, he hasn't picked her on me, simply because I know what to do against her. I play Sentinel and Doom regularly, two characters that Cammy has much difficulty with. I've played against a lot of Cammy before. Hell, I was the first person who actually LIKED Cammy in this game, way back in March 2000. I've played her for so long that I know how to stop her now.

"And I'd beat you any day, fag. I was the best at Marvel vs Capcom, that actually took skill, and me and my friend would get up to 50 matches played in a couple of hours playing. We were the best at that game. We're still the best at the game, and we'd beat any fags at Marvel vs Capcom 2 who tried to stop us."

You aren't Arturo Sanchez, generally regarded as the best at MvC1. You aren't Eddie Lee, Erik Perez or Spider-Dan either. There were lots of good MvC1 players who you probably have never played. Don't consider yourself the best if you haven't actually played anyone.

"IF YOU'RE SO GOOD, WHY AREN'T YOU FIRST PLACE? FAG?"

I'm not that good at the game. But in the case you give, if people start calling assists on me, after I kill their assist they'll only have *2* characters and I'll still have *3*. I'm not that good, but if people want to give me that kind of a handicap, I'll take it every time.
But see, people who have common sense don't call assists on me over and over. They don't want to get into a handicap match. As you can see, if you make an effort to kill assists, the game balances itself out. If you just sit and block when people call assists over and over and then go on the internet and whine about it...well...that's your fault isn't it.

"You're full of crap", basically I guess I pity you. If you think MvC1 was actually a good game and you think MvC2 is all about assists then it's obvious you haven't played anyone who knows what they're doing. That's too bad...playing fighting games against good competition is really fun. I hope someday you get to experience that.